lonely campus podcast

Episode 1: lonely campus podcast with Nate Brown
Mary Grace Almandrez
Hi, I'm Mary Grace Almandrez, the Vice President for Diversity and Inclusion. Welcome to the lonely campus podcast as presented by the Office of Diversity and Inclusion. This show is hosted by our administrative fellow Amy Messersmith. And features students just like you who share stories about the challenges and triumphs that come with trying to find your place on Syracuse University's campus.

Amy Messersmith 00:00
Hi, everybody, this is Amy Messersmith. I'm wanting the Associate Directors for HEOP and SSS here at Syracuse University. And I am also one of the Office of Diversity Inclusion administrative fellows. And so my proposed project is a pop up podcasting studio. My theme for my project is inclusion and belonging. So we have this podcast called lonely campus where we want to collect students stories about how they found their way on campus. So November 15 2023, and I'm very excited to be here when it nucleoid talking with Nate Brown.

Nate Brown 00:39
It’s nice to be here.

Amy Messersmith 00:40
So Nate, why don't you tell us a little bit about your school college, your hometown, your major?

Nate Brown 00:49
Yeah, like before I went to Syracuse, I knew that I really wanted to go into like entrepreneurship. That was like my passion for like, as long as I know, I was always trying to like find solutions to like problems. And once I found out that Syracuse had like a good like entrepreneurship program, I knew I was ready to take on this adventure. And I never really thought about like anything just besides like the curriculum, which was in colleges.

Amy Messersmith 01:16
Do you mind talking a little bit about how you got interested in entrepreneurship?

Nate Brown 01:22
Yes, I remember, I believe it was in ninth grade, when a teacher had asked me to go to this ja program where what they do as essentially they give you problems that you and your team have to like, create solutions or create a product for. And then you have to present that to a judge. And even though I didn't win any times, I still like love the process. I love solving problems. And I feel like I can do that as like a career and become your own boss. I love that like mindset where everything you do is for you and your business like it's your own thing to have.

Amy Messersmith 01:56
That's fantastic. And hometown is where?

Nate Brown 01:59
My hometown is in Rochester, New York, upstate New York.

Amy Messersmith 02:02
And you are in Whitman. (Nate: Yes.) Very nice. You're where you need to be. Do you mind telling us a little bit about your college choice process and how you ended up here at SU. Take us back?

Nate Brown 02:16
Yes. Okay. So SU wasn't my wasn't my first choice. I wanted to be closer to home, I wanted to work at the same time. And another school actually had gave me like the same offer where there was going to pay off my whole tuition. It was St. , it was so close to home. But their entrepreneurship program just got started. So I was really basing it off of curriculum. And I saw that SU had a very good business, you know, score Whitman that I can get into. So aside from not working close to home, I decided to move out to Syracuse for the curriculum. And I knew there was other aspects when it comes to like choosing your college, but I don't know why I was so like, fixated on like, what curriculum will get me to like my goal or my career the most efficiently.

Amy Messersmith 03:00
So you had a vision, you had a goal, you knew the kind of degree that you wanted to get you knew that it was going to serve a particular purpose in your career path. Yeah. And so you went with the school that had a more established-

Nate Brown 03:13
more rigorous, like curriculum, because I know that so my mom, always my mom, my dad always talks about having a strong education always being educated. So I couldn't like to settle for less just because it was more convenient. I had to like push myself to try to work and try to like, manage myself when I'm at, you know, somewhere farther from home.

Amy Messersmith 03:30
So it took you outside of Rochester.

Nate Brown 03:34
Yeah, it's only like two hours away, but I still feel like as a Rochester, they're so far away.

Amy Messersmith 03:40
Before coming to SU, can you talk a little bit about what you imagined college to be?

Nate Brown 03:46
Yeah, so when you see TV shows, you know, you see college as this like this happy, you know, bright place everybody's you know, sort of getting along, and even some TV shows may portray, like the dark sides of like cars, where you may develop mental illnesses, or like the courses are very rigorous very hard. But when I first got here, I never, you know, felt what I saw on the TV shows, it's like your expectations get like race so high before you get to college. And then when you actually get here it's like, it's not all like happy and like joyful as you like saw on the TV shows. It's like you only be happy if you stay on top of your classes. Like put your classes first. So you know, I think that like portrayal before college is like very misleading to think that is just like, you know, happy everybody's just like getting along just more of like, you have to like declare classes, you know, you may struggle between there and that's the only way you're going to like have fun you have to later classes.

Amy Messersmith 04:40
You know, it's interesting in those images and representations we see in like TVs or film. You never see them studying.

Nate Brown 04:51
That's what I was like you see them playing frisbee in the quads and it's like, Do you ever go to your dorm?

Amy Messersmith 05:04
Like right you so yeah, it’s very, almost liked programmed almost when you see on TV, and it's more about the storyline and the social aspect, but they don't really talk about-

Nate Brown 05:09
talk about like, really how rigorous like, yeah, there is some TV shows that really does like dive deep into like how professors can like be really hard on like students, or you can like Miss over to classes, there's some TV shows that dive down in there. And you're more knowledge about that before you get to college. But it's like when you get to college, like that's what you're mainly like, trying to focus on. I will say that's for me, there's more social aspects, you know, there's times for like, you go to like a club or event, but mainly, like, you're not going to be happy, like you see on TV shows if you don't handle all your, like priorities for us.

Amy Messersmith 05:40
But I know that's not part of the movie.

Nate Brown 05:45
That’s not what they they put in here.

Amy Messersmith 05:46
Can you talk a little bit about what it was like to come to campus for the first time, like what your moving experience was, like, maybe the first couple days of orientation, being in this new environment.

Nate Brown 05:58
So the moving process to me it was a lot, I liked the moving process, I loved that I loved how everybody was nervous, like, as you noticed me, I can sense it. You know, everybody was a little bit anxious for me, new people. But we were also like, excited to meet people like, to save time. And when I go to my dorm, and I look down in my hallways, I see that, you know, I don't see a lot of people like generally from my community, there's a lot of Caucasians like around me. So it's like, they're they're all like bonding in a way. So like as the week progresses, as moving, like gets deeper, I see everybody already, you know, bonding over there, all communities are there like race? And it's like, no, you have to venture outwards, more beyond your dorm or more beyond your hall to like, find us and community that everybody else was finding there.

Amy Messersmith 06:45
I think what you just described is so important for people to understand. Yeah, you know, it's interesting, my observation, you know, this is not a scientific finding. But my observation or my theory, yes, my unproven theory, thank you is that the vast majority of Caucasian students that attend SU, you went to predominantly white high schools, and therefore, I think what happens is this idea of like, like, clumping together with like, or like being attracted to like, and so white students just kind of tend to gravitate towards one another because it's familiar. And on the surface, there's nothing really wrong with that.

Nate Brown 07:32
I was just gonna say that, like, there's really nothing wrong in that fact. Because I think Caucasian students based more off of just people that are like, similar to who whom they have, like grown up with, or like, the communities they have, like grown up with. So it's, I never really like looked down and like, you know, shamed them for or like, blamed them for it. But it's like, I will kind of like do the same thing. I'll try to find the community that most like suits me or people that are similar to whom I've like grown up with. So I never like really like blamed them for it, there was never in the wrong, but it's still like a problem that needs to be like addressed.

Amy Messersmith 08:07
I think that's exactly it, Nate it’s that it's understandable. But at the same time, if we're going to be a campus that interacts with each other and becomes a community, what happens exactly what you experienced, the first couple of days of orientation is that eventually, it just kind of people gravitate away, if they're gravitating towards, they're also gravitating away from something-

Nate Brown 08:32
or forgetting something in the process.

Amy Messersmith 08:35
Exactly, and so that's the part that I'm trying to get to, and unpack. And I think the first step is talking about it. And I think you identified it in a really simple and powerful way.

Nate Brown 08:47
Because I was talking to one of my co workers and there was also describing to me how like when they first got into like Day Hall, Abbv Hall, the first thing they saw was like a lot of like Caucasians around them. And when they got into like, South Campus, there were more like people from Asia heritage, there's more like, African American, yeah, African American students. So it's like for the first year, you're automatically put in this like community where it's pushing you to like bond, but it's like, it's not because you're don't like come from that community. Like you don't understand how I socialized? How would I you know, like, what things do they like what topics you know, do we you know, share? So it's a big like, gap.

Amy Messersmith 09:25
And I think, I think when there is that gap, because, you know, if students have similar backgrounds, the gap is very small. And so it's not that you don't have to go outside of yourself very much to have those connections and conversations and you've got the similar points of references, and you might be listening to same kind of culture, art, movies, film, whereas if there's a larger gap, then it's like, the wider the gap, the less likely people are going to try to bridge it. I don't know. That's my observation. You know, because it takes more risk. It takes a little bit of vulnerability, it takes a little bit of uncomfortableness to try to bridge that gap. And so that’s what I think happens is, instead of trying, students kind of just want to like-

Nate Brown 10:11
and yeah, because even some places I go, like I will go to like the barber shop here. And even though they Yes, they are a student of colors, it's like, we may not bond as much, because they're mainly from like New York City. So I always thought, like, even if they did accept me in their group, while I even like, feel comfortable, like being there, because I never really came from that community. So it's like, our brother wants to like, as everyone else has some watch, like, stick to their, like community that you have always been associated with. So it does take like a level of like vulnerability to like, go out and like venture to like different communities. But I think most students just want that like level of like safety. Likes, they want to know that they’re in a group that they can easily open up with or like talk with, that’s really powerful.

Amy Messersmith 10:57
And you bring up a really interesting point in terms of I think we think about identities that relates to race, ethnicity or gender, but also look at the layer of geographical difference in region and hometown. Do you mind talking a little bit more about that?

Nate Brown 11:14
Yes. Even before I went on this podcast, I was thinking like, it's more than just like race that can like barn. You know, people, I was thinking specifically, as you said this about the community or like the geographic that you came from, because I know we have like the one I tend to Euclid house dust made for all students of colors. But even amongst us were split up between different communities. Like I remember, I went to this one event, I think it was like this fashion show. And I overheard a conversation one of the person was asking, you know, they're like, “what part of Africa did you come from?” And I will go to like a Hispanic frat party, you know, we hear them say, “Oh, well what your heritage are you?” So they're really like bonding over that. Geograph is not just, they're not just going to any, like student of color, or any body that's Latina. And just like, you know, bonding, you know, with them, or trying to, like break out that show, they're actually trying to, like find, like someone that in their community to, so they can like bond with them.

Amy Messersmith 12:11
So this idea that, you know, because I think maybe the assumption from the outside looking in is, oh, there's similarity there. But then to look at this nuanced approach of under this category, or, you know, this category of difference, whether we're looking at Black or African American, specifically black, there could be so much more nuance there in terms of identity. And I think that's a really important consideration. Yeah, especially like I've seen it in terms of with Summer Start students all Hu PNS. assess students participate in Summer Start if they're coming in their first year. And I definitely see how the students who are in we have so many students from the New York City region, which is fantastic. And I also see how students, you know, I've had students from Miami, I've had students from Texas, I've had students from DC students from Rochester trying to navigate that, because there's such a strong bond to be from the New York City area. And so that's a plus that's a positive, but it can also kind of be a tough nut to crack if you're-

Nate Brown 13:16
to try to like bond, you know, when you because even at the barber shop, I can tell they have like their own lifestyle don't like culture that's coming that's associated with New York City. And I can even say with like Texas, Miami, there's like certain cultures or lifestyles that come with it, even if it's not as explicit. So it just, it just seems even comfortable to you try to like pry your way into it. If you're if you don't share those same similarities with them.

Amy Messersmith 13:41
I can see that and you know, nothing against by any means students from New York City, it's a positive thing to have that commonality. And so maybe it's just a little bit of envy.

Nate Brown 13:53
Again, it's never their fault. It's never, I don't think no one's really at fault here is just like, it's just us wanting to have that safety again. You know, we don't want to like try to make ourselves even more uncomfortable as we have been like we're in college we're doing the middle classes, I think like that students want is just to like, have their own community, their own group, they can go back into like, you know, in case there were like struggling or if they needed them, they just have that safety with them because this is college was already a risk to have. So venturing out to like new people is it's like an added like risks to you while being in college.

Amy Messersmith 14:32
Yeah, I like how you use that term safety because I think it really captures it. Because when you have that sense of safety that you know what you throw out there, they're gonna pick up that you don't have to try as hard. You know, the people you're speaking with are going to understand what you're talking about your references, and then it's like, it takes less energy.

Nate Brown 14:54
Yes, like it’s way easier to borrow like, that's why I always want to say it's just snowball. Before for choosing that path, but if we were to break that barrier, it takes a bit of like discomfort and vulnerability to break that barrier within each other. So if we can all find like a common ground, we all make our own culture, our lifestyle right here in Syracuse, instead of relying on our past cultures, we can like create a new one while still acknowledging our past.

Amy Messersmith 15:27
I like that, (Nate: because as entrepreneurs) I think that that's, that's a great vision to have, like, we all come from different backgrounds, and we bring a little bit of that with us here. But in this new space, we also have the opportunity to something like that a lot. Like how do we get there?

Nate Brown 15:46
That's the okay. My like, first idea was thinking like events or like maybe startup I want to say clubs or programs, I feel like it should be more than just like race, I think it should be more of like you and if you want to bond over committee, just be specific about it. Like, you know, this is about people from like New York City or from Africa, because there's nothing wrong with having that one group or that one of it. But you know, I think we should like push race to think that like everybody is just exactly the same just because of their race. So I think we should just push that agenda off and try to find like a new common ground. And also one thing I noticed like every time I go into the SENSESnlab, I don't know where everybody is from in there, but I know they all come there to bond dislike a new friendship and you might think would they ever like be both ever be friends if SENSES wasn't created? So I think there's like an importance of creating events where it's more focused on like, different goals maybe like attributes that you know, people have like maybe like if you're a NewHouse learner or a Whitman student, you know, different goals other than like race, and then you just naturally born with people that not even their same race or came from your same community, it forces you into that habit, while finding new common ground, it might not make Syracuse, collectively, a whole culture, a whole different lifestyle, but I think they'll push you to like get out their boundaries and be exposed to new communities or new lifestyle choices.

Amy Messersmith 17:13
It's so interesting that you say that because that is exactly our thought behind some of this, let's use music production and podcasting as a means to connect with like minded similarly interested people, and then we can get to know one another, not just talking about our identities, but to the shared interest in creating and that just kind of organically those relationships kind of organically happen.

Nate Brown 17:41
Just like you end up meeting new people, it's like you put aside the expected communities that you want to be in for a second you just focus on creating like a new bond. And before you know it, you're creating like your own culture right then and there in SENSES. So I feel like worth that is like crucial to have on campus besides just programs for like, what race you're in, or you know, saying and it's crucial to have that so to be like, you know, acknowledging your different race, I think they just opened up the Native Americans a house right next to it and Euclid so I love that they're still showing appreciation of like different cultures and where you're coming from, they still taking that pride, but in order to really like break that barrier to like, have everyone come together, you need more than just race to like aren't someone someone with something but like a common goal, that sort of scarf on campus.

Amy Messersmith 18:29
I 100% agree with what you're saying that it's like kind of like a multi-pronged approach, to have the spaces that people from different communities can kind of come together and feel some degree of solidarity and unity and safety in then at the same time having spaces that are based on interests where people from all different backgrounds can interact not just because they come from different backgrounds because there's something that's speaking to their shared humanity that was the the phrase that kind of stuck in my head in terms of you know, launching SENSES is this idea that music and dialogue and food we haven't gotten to food yet but you know that really speaks to and it highlights our commonality. I'm really excited to hear you say that as a first year student coming to SENSES just appreciate that.

Nate Brown 19:19
I mean imagine if there was like a house just like one or two Euclid was just like an open space I don't know if it'll be chaotic but and maybe there's like a common ground or a goal that you know the house like specifically has but if people can just like come and show no matter what race you are I thought like they'll really like push people to like especially since the house is so like closed in it's like it's almost impossible not to notice that like person like steam for like that would be I mean I think we have those like shine and go steam or people come but they're like so open but you have like one house where you can come and show it just forces you to like talk to someone know if you see someone on the couch just like even though environment is very comfortable and cozy for you to go and talk to someone so I feel like the environment like matters to like What type of like housing? Are you in? That a great idea?

Amy Messersmith 20:02
Yeah, that'd be great because it would be more intimate. A house is a more intimate setting than Schine, you know, because you see Schine. And even if you walk into Schine still see those, like different groups kind of like sectioned off, everybody's there, like, together, but they're not.

Nate Brown 20:10
They're just what they're grouped together at that place. So I feel like something smallest between cozy can like even the census, like the to like, go into a census is more closed down. So you're more prone to like, talk to more people there, instead of bringing your own group in and just having that bubble without talking to anybody else.

Amy Messersmith 20:36
I'm thinking of like a social experiment where like, there was a space where like, we would like randomly lottery pick 20 students or 10 students, or a certain number and be like, you randomly chosen students, this is your space for the next month. That's you guys all come together. This is your turn to come here and just kind of see what evolved.

Nate Brown 20:58
That's excellent. That's exactly randomize it. Yes.

Amy Messersmith 21:02
Yes. That's to be into it. And then they could like talk and it would just kind of be this.

Nate Brown 21:07
Yeah. Cuz that's similar to like, what frat houses is but even frat houses are like bonding over just like, well raise your soft like that. That's like the next because I was trying to figure out how would you even like manage that in a house? Like if you had a house and you said, hey, everybody from a SU is invited, that'd be hard to manage. But if like randomize and get to a certain amount, that's yeah, that's better.

Amy Messersmith 21:28
So students could like opt in at the beginning, like, do you want to be a part of this social experiment, if they sign up, then sometimes throughout the academic year, they're gonna get a certain period where their number is called, and they have to come and just get to know a whole new group of people. And maybe there's like,

Nate Brown 21:43
like, a sorry, there can even be like, a common goal, like what is someone wanted? Was you gonna say that? (Amy: Keep going) Like, what if there was like a hospital music house for art house for is it can be a house, and I know, we have like the new house, the Whitman houses, and I know those are specifically for people's like adventures, but what if you had just a house away from like academics just for a little bit, somewhere where you can just like, freely go and like play? Do you know how hard it is to like, find like a piano somewhere, like I have to go into like Krauss and all the doors are locked. So it's like, you can't really even use the pianos even though you're not from that school. So I feel like having a house where it's just open to all like, you know, no matter if you're from Whitman, or NewHouse, if you know how to play piano, you could just come in and start you know, playing but that's specifically to me, you know, that's specifically to me.

Amy Messersmith 22:30
And then maybe it would be like, it wouldn't be completely structured. But there would be like, certain structured elements just to kind of like get things going. Like first thing you guys you know, get to know each other in this way. And maybe there's like a mural that they have to do by the end or like some kind of creative like joint not, I mean, it doesn't have to be a mural. Maybe it's like a song or like

Nate Brown 22:52
Some type of event because how it gets created like an album. There can be like an album making, like an art show for like artists, you know,

Amy Messersmith 22:59
Like draw each other something. Yeah. That would be a fun social experiment. Yeah.

Nate Brown 23:05
No, that's, that's I think that's excellent. Plans, like move above race and just have like, new common grounds for bonding. That's a good idea. What should we call it? Like the houses or

Amy Messersmith 23:17
like the pocket something else? Like should we call it Random House? No, that's, that's a book.

Nate Brown 23:28
Wait, if you're using if you're using adventure, just in the Random House? Or should it be like specific to their natures?

Amy Messersmith 23:39
Wow, we just went everywhere.

Nate Brown 23:43
Yeah, I noticed that we probably were on the questions. But

Amy Messersmith 23:48
let me ask you this. How would you describe in your way what a sense of belonging feels like to you? How do you know when you feel like you belong? I guess that's what I'm asking

Nate Brown 24:00
I believe is really based off of comfortability coming from the Summer Start group I was able to create my you know, group, I was able to meet new people. And we kind of formed our own like, you know, group social group, you're here for college and I can like really rely on them because I'm very comfortable being around them, I got to know them a lot. So I feel like sense of belonging is being able to like really, like be comfortable showing your true self you know, no matter like where you came from, I know that they will, like accept you too. For you know, you don't want to just it's nice to push off your boundaries and find something new. But I feel like sense of belonging is it don't have to be, you know, a shared commonality, like your race or where you come from. I think it just really like depends on how comfortable you are in that around the people that you choose to be around

Amy Messersmith 24:46
so that you have that sense of safety. (Nate: Yeah, again. Yeah.)

Nate Brown 24:54
And I think maybe it takes a little less effort. Yeah, it takes less effort, but it's like in the long run. It will be more easier if we did push our boundary too. Because then like, when you get into college, it's, it's not everybody just sticking to their groups, they're more comfortable. Because even, this is gonna be a stretch, even the book I'm reading is called “Influence”, they talk about how you have to be comfortable being uncomfortable. So eventually, if you're in comfortable situations a lot, like let's say you don't like public speaking, if you keep, you know, venturing out to do public speaking, eventually, you're going to get rid of that fear to do it. So that kind of aligns with college to where if you keep pushing yourself, if you allow students to, like push themselves and find, you know, new communities to like, try to like venture into then eventually we'll get rid of that fear. And I want to go that safety. And we'll just as I said before, be it like that whole, like su community or a whole culture or lifestyle to be a part of

Amy Messersmith 25:49
fantastic thinking about on the other end of the spectrum, loneliness as a first year student, at what point did you recognize that you might be feeling lonely?

Nate Brown 26:01
Yeah, totally. When I went to the barber, again, they were all from like, New York City. And I was just sitting in a chair, and I didn't know how to, you know, approach, I didn't know how to socialize. It's like, I forgot everything I resocialize this girl I had right then and there, I knew that Buerk I was comfortable in the fact that I knew that we're both certain colors, who saw certain colors, but I knew there was still like a barrier. Because I was never gone up in New York City, I never was accustomed to people from their cities lifestyle. So I guess that's like the first time that I've like really, you know, experienced that like differentiation. And then after that, it just kinda like grown, where you see many more examples, even like most events are for like, boosting black pride vote, when you go to them is specifically for Africa and their, like shared values. And, you know, me, I was I never knew, like, the values to Africa, you know, has or being from Africa. So I can tell that was another barrier where people are bonding over, you know, the exact Geograph of like, being a sort of color. So I guess that's like, where I see, you know, certainly a bit lonely.

Amy Messersmith 27:14
It’s interesting, because within those spaces, there are similarities. Yeah. But almost maybe it can amplify the differences or the feeling of difference. I don't I don't know if I'm saying that. Right.

Nate Brown 27:27
So like, with New York City, they have the same commonality. But it's like, the fact that it's so strong means that there's going to also be a stronger barrier from like someone else. Right. Yeah.

Amy Messersmith 27:39
I think that that's a nuanced perspective and understanding of that situation, then it's important for us to talk about and acknowledge and the fact that you're willing to have this conversation, you know, somebody's coming in, in 2024 in 2025 You know, my career.

Nate Brown 27:58
And what I love so much about this, and what makes me feel so much comfortable addressing this is like, it's like, again, it's no one's like fault, it's like something that no one really talks about, but it's, it's kind of like hidden, so it's a, that's like, almost hidden that everybody knows, but they don't know how to like really put it, it's like something underlined like with the universe that you can't really see. You just like fill it in, like different, like places, but there's no one really to talk to because no one really talks about it. No one really thinks like that deeply about it, but it's still like a problem is still like a concern. Because once you find your safety, it's like, no matter what happens, I know I have my safety to go back to so no one really wants to speak about it because we all have like people to go back to ourselves. So that's why you know, I feel like it's important to like address this problem because it's so hidden like it's not in plain sight where people can see it's because you know that before it was like you know trying to get people from different races to like bond. So they create like different events or different programs clubs, but now it's more than that and it's not that visible to like see you have to just experience it and then like really talk it out and then you realize I just

Amy Messersmith 29:12
I'm so grateful that you're willing to talk about it. I really appreciate that because I think it's time Yeah, you know, because

Nate Brown 29:22
I it's the hardest part is that I don't know how many other students feel the same way (Amy: Exactly). That's That's why I keep saying it's so hidden because it's like you don't know because no one else is like really speaking up about it.

Amy Messersmith 29:55
It's interesting. It's like maybe a metaphor would be like if we were fish in Water, it's like present. So it'd be like an unspoken current that we're kind of like maneuvering in, but we don't necessarily see it.

Nate Brown 30:08
So you just have to like really like, think about it. And notice that it's a problem. It's one of those things where it's like, it's a huge like, you could sense that something is wrong, but you just don't know what because everybody is like content are happy with, you know how they are, I hope so that they are happy. And consent, yes, have a consent with, you know, the goose that they have chosen. So it's, it's not really talked off.

Amy Messersmith 30:34
So as a first year student, and I do think it would be interesting to revisit your, your journey at SU over the next three and a half years to see where that's gonna go, because I think that'd be really interesting. But I'm wondering, do you have any coping mechanisms when you're in periods of loneliness,

Nate Brown 30:54
I will say one coping mechanism that I have acquired is calling upon like people that are in your group, that people that you feel safe with to give you that reassurance that you're not alone, like you're not alone in that presence right then and there is just that you may not share there, cuz sometimes I get in those situations, and I start overthinking where it's like, maybe the whole campus is like just bare like barred off, you know, it's a differentiate away. So it's good to have those reassurances. Maybe it maybe it doesn't even have to be someone from campus, it can be like your, you know, your parents, or it could be a friend from like, home. And just to like, let you know that even though you may feel lonely at this present, there's still people that care about you, or there's still people that still wants to be around. So I feel like that's important to have to, like cope with.

Amy Messersmith 31:39
I think that's really, really important. It's interesting, because I think about, like my experience as an undergraduate. And I think for me, it was almost like I was, so it was almost like shameful to feel lonely. So you didn't want to reach out and admit that you're lonely, or that you know, so it's kind of like, that's what you need to do.

Nate Brown 31:59
It's one of those hidden hidden things that people like, because people mostly like shame it off. And you may think that not just from this, but like even going to like someone from like a doorman, you may think that stating that you're lonely is like may hope but they don't have no like skills to like, address that. And so it's like, it's another thing where I don't blame them, because no one has like the skills to like, address that almost. So I feel like you'll be even like making a like a deeper hole for yourself or whatnot. Because it takes that one person to be vulnerable and reach out and to comfort the person that may be feeling alone. And there's some people that just wants to like, you know, back away from it almost. And just kind of like stick for the safety and don't want to add nothing on or don't want to have to do what makes sense.

Amy Messersmith 32:46
It might be not where they want to put their energy at that moment, or what they want to take on. Or they might not have the skills or I don't know, like they could be a jerk about it and just use it as an opportunity to feel superior.

Nate Brown 33:00
So yeah, like, I feel like food meat may even use that to like boost their own, like, you know, their own bonding or whatnot. So that's what I'm saying. I don't know if anybody else is feeling like lonely out there. But I know, it's hard to like, you know, put yourself out there and talk about it like that.

Amy Messersmith 33:18
Again, I sound like a broken record. That's why I think it's so important to have these conversations because, right coping mechanisms, okay, reach out. But that could go in a lot of different directions. I would say maybe, like, what you were saying, like, reach out to somebody reliable, that you know, is going to be a soft place to land. And maybe not necessarily to your newest friends that you've met until you know,

Nate Brown 33:43
Yeah, cuz like, I don't think it's fair that someone should just take on your trauma, like, especially, I think it's like ethical, I think just like, you know, very good ethics to like, take, you know, have a personality, even though you may not know them, but I mean, the way I see it is that no one really acts for like, I don't know if that, like makes sense,

Amy Messersmith 34:02
or not responsible for others, kind of or you don't want to take on you don't want to become responsible for somebody else kind of thing. Yeah,

Nate Brown 34:10
especially when you like, you know, don't know don't miss like, as I said, with the skills to like, they don't have their card like skills to speak about it, because I feel like everybody wants to have safety. He wants to have fun. And I felt like because I can't tell if that's like a good like a reasonable thing to like excuse or is that like something that's a problem and you know, you to push people need a push to like, you know, approach a child to like help.

Amy Messersmith 34:34
I know, it's like, I think both because in some ways, it is maybe unreasonable to expect like an 18 year old here to be able to handle somebody else's loneliness and you know, it would it's understandable if they kind of back away from that kind of emotional work on the other hand, because t's like you may not even know what you're what you're doing exactly.

Nate Brown 34:54
Like, even if he they may Ah, tell it to you like it's nothing almost like it, they're made like saying this is most like simplest form, you know, you just may be adding on extra trauma that you don't feel like really realized, because we don't have a certificate and like say, you know, psychology or psychotherapy, so no one knows how to, like address it. So it's understandable that they don't so

Amy Messersmith 35:20
right. On the other hand, it's like what you're saying like, is that something? I don't know? Because if we're trying to build community is there because the other side of that is be available to people be supportive? VSD? You know, yeah, that's like, both, and is

Nate Brown 35:36
the same thing with like, parenting is most, you know, parents may not be taught how to parent or whatnot. So yeah, you should hope but if you don't have those skills, I think it's at least best to, like, point them into direction of someone that does, like, if you go to like barns or whatnot, you know, they may have like, people that are qualified to actually deal with it. But I think taking it upon yourself, that's, I can understand if they don't want to, like if they find it more of like a risk than hope,

Amy Messersmith 36:06
what are some things that would be less risky? That might help? In my head? I'm thinking like, maybe sharing a meal,

Nate Brown 36:16
or saying like, amongst students, yes.

Amy Messersmith 36:19
Like, how can we be supportive without kind of crossing the boundary of mental health support,

Nate Brown `36:25
I will say, it's the little things I feel like you shouldn't try to, like solve or anything like that, try to like, figure the whole thing out and try to put your whole life basis into it. I think it's just like, the small things that you know, people like or appreciate, can be as small as opening up the door, as you say, like sharing Gmail, it doesn't have to be, you know, this whole, like, big, you know, solution to try to help them I feel like just more like appreciation, like small gestures of like, appreciation, you know, can I go a long way cuz you can't really, I would say, like a mess, you know that up, you can't, I wouldn't know how that becomes like more of a risk, but just showing more positivity or showing those like good gestures can help like in the long run, or hope, you know, at least like a little bit. So if you want to give like support.

Amy Messersmith 37:09
I think that's really wise. I think what we're talking about is really important in terms of knowing your boundary, knowing your role, being aware that you don't want to do unintentional more harm. But you also want to don't want to turn your back completely. And so what's the fine line there? What's the middle ground and the idea of just kindness in the form of acknowledging somebody's presence and holding the door even

Nate Brown 37:35
just the hug like instead of being that person that just kind of like want to back out of it and walk away you don't ever have to like send them like major you can just give out a hug or whatnot. You can give them your Instagram people does it sometimes and just check up on them like get their Instagram check up on them see how they're doing it just stuff you know like that but like don't try to like go in depth into like what there's you know, delinquent actually pointing to someone that can actually help with I think that, that is really wise.

Amy Messersmith 38:02
tYeah, because you're showing that you're present and that you care Yeah,

Nate Brown 38:09
but and even that can go along even that can try to help but

Amy Messersmith 38:13
you're not putting yourself at risk and you're not inadvertently putting them at risk. Nice. That's essentially a really smart time.

Nate Brown 38:19
Yeah, to have like small gestures. So you're you know, like I say you have your own group or your you know, friend group you know, you're having fun, you don't have to like just completely cut off for that and then focus on someone else you can just do small things that doesn't even take a lot you know to do. So that's that's very wise for someone to take upon.

Amy Messersmith 38:40
We'll call it the brown approach. I don't mind I don't want so I know that you're only a couple months into your college experience, but what steps did you take to figure out the spaces and places on campus where you did find a sense of belonging? Can you describe the spaces and the people who provided a sense of community for you and how do you go about maintaining those relationships?

Nate Brown 39:09
I believe it was during the Summer Start program where we had this fear this like club here where you can go around and like you know see different clubs like the one that started to me was the launchpad the launchpad club or organization which I love I like going into that one because it's like no matter who comes in you're just it's so easy to like you know bond with them you can ask like what you know business do you want to like have it's like so easy to start a conversation with and to have that common goal to be around people that you know you have that same and you know mentality that same drive the same goal for it's it boosts Is it almost like so the launchpad and already said the census group that's like the main lead the main two that I had, it was so easy to start conversations. And so even this other day when I was working on my project is a grossinger behind me or whatnot. So I asked her if she wanted to, if she, you know, she can sing on, you know, my check on my project that she was doing if she would like to, like, you know, if she really likes it. So just like that it was easy like, we're able to like bond or, you know, even with the employees that work there, I was able to like, even asking for help can like start like a conversation or start like a bond. That's why I like love those like environments where it's like, you just put everything else away and just look at the same goal, like the entrepreneur should go like to have a business or to become your own artists. You know, I love that about those two places last night with the name de two places that I really like, you know, venture out to go. So,

Amy Messersmith 40:40
you know, what stands out to me is that I think what plays a big role is that you have a self awareness that you have a genuine passion for entrepreneurship and a genuine passion for music. So that's enough to carry you into a new space and kind of engage you because, you know, you're going to find like minded people, and that's enough to find you. And I think maybe some students who are still looking for that struggle, because they don't have something that they know, they're so passionate about.

Nate Brown 41:13
Yeah, I get that. So I feel like it's a lot of like self discovery to find, what is it that makes you happy, the most famous music are, you know, entrepreneurship, it's, it's always nice to, like, know yourself first, or even just still venture out to those communities and see, if you, you know, would like to like to join them too, or it's like, you know, hop on, like a project, or not, that they're doing and just try different things to see, you know, what you like, so, it's going to be more of like a longer process to find a community, but it's still gonna get you like the results, you know, that are somewhere where you could find out like a sense of belonging.

Amy Messersmith 41:49
Finally, what words of encouragement or advice do you have for incoming students who in the future might be experiencing similar feelings that you were feeling in terms of loneliness and isolation? Do you have any words of wisdom to share,

Nate Brown 42:05
I would say, coming into college is a big risk, it is a big risk to try to venture out to new people or whatnot, that you may not, that you may not know, or you may not have came from the same communities with but I feel like it's important to still like venture out, like, you know, venture out to different clubs or whatnot, that you may not have, like, passionate would just like to like, learn their passions, how to like learn their cultures, or their lifestyles, or whatnot. And I feel like that will make you even with more comfortable being able to be around different environments other than, you know, the one you're comfortable with, and then eventually, you know, because we're here for four years, so eventually, you will be able to feel more comfortable, you know, branching out to different communities or whatnot, even when it gets the real room. So I feel like it's important, like, yes, you want to find, you know, a group that you're comfortable with, you know, it's good to find people that you know, have common ground as you. But I feel like if you don't want to feel that, that loneliness or for that disconnection, I feel like it's important to still try to like reach out because it just takes one person to try to like reach out and you never know it may happen. Everybody else can start which not adventuring and then you can create while learning their own culture. You can create your own like culture right then and there. You know, so I feel like it's crucial just to like break out your break Archer show just a little and like, you know, be comfortable with being uncomfortable.

Amy Messersmith 43:26
That’s fantastic. This has been a fantastic conversation overall. I've really enjoyed this. (Nate: I'm glad I'm glad I've joined.) We gotta keep doing it. This conversation will continue. All right. Thank you, Nate.

Nate Brown 43:39
Thanks you, its nice to be, its nice being here.

Amy Messersmith 43:42
All right. Bye, everybody.